Virginia, An open City?

I live in WV where open carry has always been legal --- and to be honest, you almost NEVER see anyone with a holster on their hip out in the open. I don't really see this law changing much in Virginia either.
One of the downsides to open carry is that so many "sheeple" fear guns and those that carry them and this could cause a problem. Alot of malls and other business's have signs up that say "NO FIREARMS". When I am concealed carrying my pistol, no one knows I am carrying and thus no problems -- but if you are opening carrying, you can be asked to leave, and should you refuse, you can be cited and prosecuted for trespassing.

From what I've read, this isn't a new law, but gunnies availing themselves of the existing open carry law because some of the newer MOS seem to think Viginia's CCW law did away with open carry. The movement seems to have started around Fairfax, Southwest of DC. One person was arrested about a month back. Once the officer got the arrestee to the station, the officer was apprised of his error, the man released from custody and his handgun returned. Word quickly spread and an in-your-face open carry move sprang up.

I've been to Ft Lee and the Blackstone area years back and don't remember seeing locals packing. Now in sierra Vista, AZ, that's a little different story, but not much.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/ar ... l14_2.html

There have been a couple of stories in recent issues of Gun Week about a man who got arrested in a book store in Manchester, NH for open carry. As I recall, he was eventually released without being charged, and the police were given reminders that open carry is legal without a permit in NH. But the guy is pressing for an investigation as to what he claims was mistreatment for legal conduct, and the stories said he has even met with the governor on the issue.

My point in mentioning this is that just because it is legal doesn't mean you can't get arrested. One must decide for himself or herself whether, in a given situation, open carry is a wise choice even if perfectly legal.

I grew up in Virginia and worked for a short time as a police officer. Open carry was legal, but almost never saw it. I remember stopping cars and the driver would have a handgun visible on the seat.

I recall a few calls about armed persons acting suspiciously. These turned out to be off-duty police officers in stores or hospitals.

Rob said:

My point in mentioning this is that just because it is legal doesn't mean you can't get arrested. One must decide for himself or herself whether, in a given situation, open carry is a wise choice even if perfectly legal

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Any old time MOS will tell you, "You may beat the charge, but you won't beat the ride." I like open carry in small towns or rural areas. But in big cities, concealed causes less stress for those of faint heart around me and less harassment for me. Whether I like it or not, concealed carry provides a measure of safety for those too damned timid to look to their own safety. Texas isn't an open carry state despite what the TV may lead one to think. I'll switch to open carry in El Paso as I proceed Westward into New Mexico and Arizona. And, yes, it causes stares from the tourists.

Open carry has always been legal in Va. Though in a few cities and one town it was illegal until July 1 of this year.

The problem lies in that we can not carry a concealed weapon into a restraunt that serves alcohol. BUT, we can carry openly into a restraunt that serves alcohol :roll: So you have two choices, take the gun off and leave it in your car or open carry.

Now that No. Va can open carry people are chosing the option to carry inside. Now the media is having a fit.

For a lot of good information check out... http://www.vcdl.org If you are a Virginia, then you should look into joining. A great group who really fights for our rights. (i'm a new member and went to my first meeting last night)

Here's a piece on the issue from some DC-based pants-wetter:

Those Open Arms
Washington Post
Wednesday, July 28, 2004; Page A18

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/ar ... Jul27.html

What a weenie!!!

It is so funny how anti's look at the world! I used to have a very bad and hot temper --- once I started carrying, I found my temper cooled down ALOT.

The writers analogy about the restaurant reminds me of my fathers story from being in Israel. They were there with my brother, sister-in-law and kids. My sister in law is from Union NJ and has her MSW (Masters Social Work) --- need I say GUN HATING ULTRA LIBERAL. They went to a restaurant and alot of people had Uzi Rifles leaned against the wall beside their table. My sister-in-law made the comment "It makes me feel scared to see all these guns everywhere!!"

My father dryly responded "Actually, it makes me feel alot safer!"

I browsed the Code of Virginia and found an unusual provision regarding carrying concealed weapons in Sec 18.2-308:

"For the purpose of this section, a weapon shall be deemed to be hidden from common observation when it is observable but is of such deceptive appearance as to disguise the weapon's true nature."

I wonder if this was intended to apply to the mini-.22 LR revolver-on-a-belt-buckle.

Although I sympathize with the newly minted gun-toters exercising their recovered rights, I don't plan to follow their lead. Always felt that a weapon unexpected is a weapon most effective and prefer the tactical advantage of surprise. It has been entertaining to watch the hoplophobes squawk on the ed pages though

WaltGraham said:

Although I sympathize with the newly minted gun-toters exercising their recovered rights, I don't plan to follow their lead. Always felt that a weapon unexpected is a weapon most effective and prefer the tactical advantage of surprise. It has been entertaining to watch the hoplophobes squawk on the ed pages though

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That's the problem in Va though. Most of these incidents are occuring in restraunts. Since we can not legally carry concealed into a restraunt that serves alcohol, you have to carry open or not carry at all. Hopefully next year we can get this changed to where we can carry concealed into a restraunt, though I'm not holding my breath.

Do all you can by writing and calling and also look into the VCDL http://www.vcdl.org

Understood - although I've always felt that my personal security as well as the Constitution trumps any local ordinance...

No Opinion On Crime Rate?

Gents,
So no one has an opinion on the rate of crime for the city of Virginia?
It would seem to me that a BG would probably leave an innocent alone if he sees him/her packing. Don't you think?
I don't claim to understand the mind of an evil doer. But that theory of logic makes sense to me. Some people may argue then, that would be an escalation of violence. You know the lib mind as well as I do! They think when people start carrying sidearms than the BG's will start carrying sidearms. And when the BG needs a fix for his drugs or whatever, he simply grabs his peace and out the door he goes! Hence, theres gun play in the streets!
One could also argue that this road leads to vigilantism. Armed citizenry walking around the streets of neighborhoods looking for unscrupulous scoundrels lurking about.
I don't know, it could happen. Right?

JRWnTN said:

I browsed the Code of Virginia and found an unusual provision regarding carrying concealed weapons in Sec 18.2-308:

"For the purpose of this section, a weapon shall be deemed to be hidden from common observation when it is observable but is of such deceptive appearance as to disguise the weapon's true nature."

I wonder if this was intended to apply to the mini-.22 LR revolver-on-a-belt-buckle.

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Yes, as it may appear to be a toy, but mainly cane-guns, pen (zip) guns, and the like. (Edited to add: pager-guns, cellphone-guns, cigarette pack-guns)

And Virginia open carry was allowed (state level) because there was no (state) law prohibiting it. Certain localities passed ordinances forbidding it but with state-wide pre-emption coming into effect last July, all local ordinances are nullified. Thank God for some consistency! Now if we can get the non-secure airport areas back!!

VCDL is a (now) nationally recognised and lauded gun rights group. Join and be better for it!

The local (James Madison) University has sought to prohibit any sort of carry on their (taxpayer) property. One of my fellow Keezletowners is currently challenging that stance in court. I expect him to win. I'm over or through there a couple of times a week. I reckon, in some cases, ignorance is indeed bliss

WaltGraham said:

One of my fellow Keezletowners is currently challenging that stance in court. I expect him to win.

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More power to him! I am eagerly awaiting the decision. I attend a local "college" here and this issue affects me directly.

As a business traveller the airport ban greatly affected me too, as I was in and out of airports weekly, either flying or picking up/dropping off rental vehicles. I recently (1 week ago) picked up my new company-provided vehicle so no longer will I have to do the "rental" thing anymore (locally anyway!). :wink: